Freshwater Shrimp
Contents:
- [F] Fresh Water Shrimp & New Book
by sywang-at-whale.st.usm.edu (Shiao Y. Wang) (17 Aug 1994)
- [F] Report from Japan (long)
by booth-at-lvld.hp.com (George Booth) (2 Sep 1994)
- [Plant] AMAZING ALGAE EATING SHRIMP: SEEN IT?
by jkelly-at-landau.ucdavis.edu (Jim Kelly) (12 Oct 1994)
- scud-what kind of fish will eat them
by hougen-at-femto.cs.umn.edu (Dean Hougen) (Sun, 25 Jun 1995)
- Info from Japan
by George Booth <booth-at-hpmtlgb1.lvld.hp.com> (Tue, 30 May 1995)
- freshwater shrimps
by Neale Monks <N.Monks-at-nhm.ac.uk> (20 Jul 1995)
- re:Ghost Shrimp?!?
by dwebb-at-ti.com (David Webb) (Mon, 04 Dec 95)
- Yamato-Numaebi (again ?)
by Shinji Egi <egi-at-hpycla.kobe.hp.com> (Wed, 6 Dec 95)
- Aquatic Plants Digest V2 #1130
by "Roger S. Miller" <rgrmill/rt66.com> (Thu, 11 Dec 1997)
- Ghost SHrimp ID
by mark.fisher/tpwd.state.tx.us (Thu, 11 Dec 97)
- Aquatic Plants Digest V3 #57
by Rhonda Wilson <rhondawi/sprynet.com> (Fri, 30 Jan 1998)
- Boron & shrimp
by "Shiao Y. Wang" <sywang/whale.st.usm.edu> (Sat, 31 Jan 1998)
- C. Japonica
by Calvin Chin <calvinchin/letterbox.com> (Wed, 11 Mar 1998)
- Yamatos
by khewss/singnet.com.sg (Khew Sin Sun) (Sat, 14 Mar 1998)
- HELP:ghost shrimp pregnant????
by bae/cs.toronto.edu (Beverly Erlebacher) (20 Apr 98)
- HELP:ghost shrimp pregnant????
by bae/cs.toronto.edu (Beverly Erlebacher) (20 Apr 98)
- Grass Shrimp?
by shine/cbnewsh.cb.att.com (stephen.c.shine) (9 Jan 92)
- Yamatos eat black brush algae!!
by Hong Sungmin <pongpong/mail.taegu.net> (Thu, 29 Oct 1998)
- Yamato numa-ebi(Caridina japonica) FAQ's
by "Ryan Stover" <fishboy/neotown.com> (Wed, 4 Nov 1998)
- Ghost Shrimp
by "Roger S. Miller" <rgrmill/rt66.com> (Wed, 2 Dec 1998)
- ghost scrimp
by "Ryan Stover" <fishboy/neotown.com> (Wed, 25 Nov 1998)
- FW Shrimp
by krandall/world.std.com (Fri, 18 Dec 1998)
- Bumble bee shrimp in Florida
by Apflanzeneh/webtv.net (Wed, 17 Mar 1999)
- filter / wood shrimp
by "H. Hoekstra" <hugo/greed.nl> (Tue, 23 Mar 1999)
- C. japonica Stocking
by C88gthdr/aol.com (Fri, 30 Jul 1999)
- Freshwater Inverts
by "Alex" <girardinus/dubouchet.com> (Tue, 26 Oct 1999)
- RE: Ghost Shrimp
by "Brett Kemker" <bkemker/mailer.fsu.edu> (Mon, 21 Feb 2000)
- Amano Shrimp
by Scheele Juergen <juesche/earthlink.net> (Fri, 24 Aug 2001)
- Reproducing "Amano" Shrimp
by "Karen Randall" <krandall/world.std.com> (Tue, 18 Dec 2001)
- Shrimp production methods
by "Edward Venn" <e_venn/hotmail.com> (Wed, 19 Dec 2001)
- Re: Trouble with Amano Shrimp - please reply
by "Tan Kah Cheong" <tankahcheong/pacific.net.sg> (Mon, 16 Jul 2001)
- dead shrimps and pesticide residue
by Neil Frank <aquarian.subjects/mindspring.com> (Sat, 26 Jan 2002)
- Amano vs Ghost shrimps
by Thomas Barr <tcbiii/earthlink.net> (Mon, 28 Jan 2002)
- re: Amano vs Ghost shrimp
by Roger Miller <rgrmill/rt66.com> (Tue, 29 Jan 2002)
by sywang-at-whale.st.usm.edu (Shiao Y. Wang)
Date: 17 Aug 1994
Newsgroup: rec.aquaria,alt.aquaria,sci.aquaria
George Booth (booth-at-lvld.hp.com) wrote:
: Has anyone had any experience with freshwater shrimp?
Freshwater shrimp in the genera Palaemonetes are excellent scavengers
and do eat algae. The two strickly freshwater inhabitants are P.
kadiakensis and K. paludosus. Their westward distribution is limited to
the flood plains of the Mississippi River. In the southern parts of
U.S., they are found as far west as about San Antonio, TX. One thing
folks need to be aware of is that often times, the grass shrimp stocked in
fish stores are actually brachish water species (because they can be
caught in much greater abundance) that tolerate very low salinity. They do
not fare well in the long term in strickly freshwater. Another drawback is
that freshwater grass shrimp have a life span of only one year. However,
they are interesting in brooding their young and can be propagated in aquaria.
There are also freshwater shrimp native to the U.S. in the genera
Macrobrachium. However, they can get large and do damage to a plant tank.
Shiao Wang
University of Southern Mississippi
by booth-at-lvld.hp.com (George Booth)
Date: 2 Sep 1994
Newsgroup: rec.aquaria,alt.aquaria
I've been recently corresponding with a Mr. Shinji Egi in Japan about
the use of freshwater shrimp as algae eaters and the state-of-the-art
for plant tanks in Japan. He has kindly given me permission to post
excerpts from this correspondence. I think there is much of interest
here for *.aquaria readers. I have done some minor editting to remove
items that were not of general interest to the net.
==========================
~From: Shinji Egi
~Subject: Shrimps
~Date: Tue, 23 Aug 94 18:10:59 JST
Shrimps in Japan
----------------
In Japan, shrimps are commonly used to maintain the planted tanks.
A magazine says the use of shrimps is the biggest change in these
10 years in the planted-aquarium scene.
The combination of shrimps and otocinclus is the way which most books
recommend for beginners of plant tanks for controlling algae. (And,
optionally, Tetra Algae Kit for brue-green algae.) Roughly,
otocinclus are for green or brown algae on the glass, rocks and
broader leaves, on the other hand, shrimps can handle brush/hair algae
and fine leaves like moss or riccia. (I have no idea whether the
shrimps eat red algae, since I haven't figured out what the red algae
is.) According to the books, they have preference for fish food
rather than algae. So, overfeeding the fish can make the shrimps lazy
algae eaters.
There are 2 species of algae eating shrimps popular in Japan:
(1)Domestic ones (Yamato-numa-ebi i.e. Japanese-pond-shrimps)
They grow to 5cm or so. They are not tropical and likely die
when the temp gets over 30C. All the local aquarium shops I visit
carry them. They often hold eggs, but are hard to reproduce in most
planted tanks since they need brackish water for breeding.
They are supposed not to bear the pH under low 6.
(2)Bee shrimps
They grow to 2cm or so. They are from South-east Asia.
Recently, they are not well-supplied since the flood damaged the
farms (ponds) in the South-east Asia a while back. They are born in
the same shape as the parents, and easily reproduce in the planted
aquariums if no enemies are there.
There are some other shrimps (such as Rock shrimps) which can be kept
in the planted tanks. But, they are rather for scavengers.
By the way, I think I can retrieve the scientific names of these shrimps
from the books at home. Please let me know, if you are interested.
My experience
-------------
I started aquarium hobby only 13 month ago. And have not been much into
the plant world. So, my experience is quite limited.
(1)Angels love shrimps.
Books say such fish as Angelfish and Discus likely eat up the shrimps.
I put some pond shrimps in my community aquarium with a pair of Angels,
with a hope they survive in the forest of the hygros & ambria. But, ...
(2)Shrimps are good algae eaters.
For these 2 months, I'm trying to plant willow-moss and Java-fern on
some pieces of driftwood. (They are intended for killifish tanks.)
I've set up 2 10-litter tanks and keeping 3-4 shrimps in each tank
(bare bottom, and a sponge filter for one and only wood air-stone for
the other). I feed nothing, but the shrimps are always working, on
the leaves, tank walls, bottom, and produce rather much poo.
Plants are slowly growing beautiful in both tanks.
But, some algae (such as otocinclus loves) has developped on the
glass walls. So, I think I can control this by adding an otocinclus
in each tank.
After all, I think the combination of shrimps and otocinclus is a good
way to control algae. And, probally works for my community aquarium if
not for the angels.
OK, that's all my $0.02
-Shinji
P.S. I have been wondering why no one mentions the shrimps when
somebody calls for help on an algae problem in rec.aquaria.
Are shrimps rarely used as algae-eaters in the US?
==========================
~From: Shinji Egi
~Subject: Re: Shrimps
~Date: Thu, 25 Aug 94 18:11:54 JST
> I was reading a new plant book entitled "Nature Aquarium World" and
Sounds like Mr. Takashi Amano. I think he released his first photo book
Nature Aquarium World - "great nature in the glass" last year.
He released 2nd one Nature Aquarium World - "water - back to nature"
very recently. (Subtitles in "" are my translation from Japanese ones.)
He is the owner of the firm Aqua Design Amano (ADA) which supplies various
things focused to the plant aquarium use. ADA recently started a monthly
specialty magazine on the "nature aquarium" (3 issues have been released
by now.)
Mr. Amano also has been presenting one of his work in a Japanese aquarium
magazine (specifically the "AquaLife") monthly.
AquaLife interviewed him a couple of months back. He had been arranging
small size of aquarium recently. The smallest one was the 3cm x 3cm x 3cm
with Riccia tied to a disc-like stone of 2cm diameter. By the way, he
arranges 20 or so "nature aquarium" a month.
> The author
> also noted that some shrimp like to grab at fish fins but a certain
> type was very "fish friendly". Unfortunately, the names of the good
> shrimp were local Japanese names and not scientific names (as if that
> would help down at the local Gougers'R'Us fish store :-).
Local names are sometimes problems to me when I read rec.aquaria.
I wish someone makes a list of fish names like you did for plants...
I'm not sure the reliability of the following names.
For, only one of my book has the scientific names.
Anyway, here is some additional information from the books:
Yamato-numa-ebi (Japanese pond shrimp): Caridina japonica
temp 15-28C, pH neutral, size 5cm (typically sold 3cm)
Bee shrimp : Atydae sp.
temp 20-28C, pH neutral, size 2cm
Magazines say that several different species are sold as "bee shrimp".
Although usage and care are the same among those, magazines don't
mention if they can cross-breed.
Another domestic shrimp which is sold as algae eater is:
Minami-numa-ebi (Southern pond shrimp): Neocaridina denticulata
temp 15-28C, pH neutral, size 3-4cm
Following tropical shrimp does not work as algae-eater, but may work
as scavenger:
Rock shrimp : Atya sp.
temp 20-28C, pH neutral, size 8cm
All of these are supposed to be fish friendly.
A magazine mentions that all the domestic freshwater shrimps eat algae,
although their efficiency as algae eaters vary. So, I guess you have some
chance to find out US version of algae-eating shrimp by picking up some
small spieces.
> He has a neat technique of tying Riccia (a
> floating plant) to rocks with clear fishing line and using that as a
> ground cover.
Tying with clear fishing line seems to be a common technique here. But, I
din't know who first started this. I also do it for my Microsorium and
willow-moss until they fix themselves to the driftwood.
Another common method of making Riccia carpet is to cover them by some
coarse stainless steel nets. Riccia eventually grows out of the net then
hides the net. Such nets are sold at aquaria shops around here.
Patient people make willow-moss backscreens using black plastic letter-size
mesh sheets which are sold at gardening shops for flower-pot bottom. They
devide moss into small pieces, then stick a piece into a hole and take it
out from the adjoining hole. After all pair of holes are done, they let
the moss grow laying the sheet on the tank bottom.
> [stuff about red algae]
I believe the owner of the shop I regularly visit once told me that he put
100 shrimps when the black tufts had developed on his nana and that shrimps
worked out on them within a couple of days. (I should also mention that his
tanks are usually well-maintained. And I doubt the number "100", although
he sometimes has shrimps as much as that number. A magazine says 20-30 for
57-litter tank will work.)
Anyway, I think I can experiment whether shrimps eat red algae some day.
By the way, according to books, shrimps do eat plants when they are short
of algae. So, if you are cleaning plants like the shop owner did, you have
to take notice when to stop the cleaning. Otherwise, soft leaves can be
gone overnight. The recommended way is, of course, putting shrimps in
before the development of algae. Small number (3 for 57 liter tank) of
shrimps should be able to control the algae in this case.
I reviewed my aquarium books and back-numbers of magazines last night.
Types of algae seems not classified in detail by Japanese aquarists.
What books lists are blue-green (hardly anyone eats), brown, and green
(string/lawn). I guess red algae is regarded as a type of green algae.
I found a statement in a magazine that string-type green algae sometimes
become like cotton and that shrimps eat them. So, probably shrimps are
what you want.
I found the following table about rating algae-eaters in a magazine. (Note
that most article in the magazines are author's personal opinion.)
+-----------------------------------------------------------+
|Algae-eaters | brown algae | string-type | lawn-type |
|-------------------+-------------+-------------+-----------|
|Ishimaki-gai snail | 1 | 1 | 3 | 0 doesn't
|Golden Apple Snail | 1 | 2 | 3 | | eat
|Otocinclus | 3 | 0 | 1 | 1
|Siamese Algae Eater| 1 | 2 | 1 | |
|Farlowella | 3 | 0 | 1 | 2 eats
|Pencilfish | 0 | 1 | 0 | |
|Shrimps | 0 | 2 | 0 | 3 eats well
+-----------------------------------------------------------+
The author also had following comments:
(1)He doesn't think snails are useful for well-maintained tank.
(2)Pencilfish are gentler to plants than shrimps. But, does not eat
algae as far as other food exist.
Best regards,
- Shinji Egi
==========================
~From: Shinji Egi
~Subject: Re: Shrimps
~Date: Fri, 26 Aug 94 20:38:55 JST
> Are Japanese aquariums mostly planted or is Mr. Amano an exception?
Although Amano-san is surely an exception, there seems to be many amateur
plant aqualists. But, I'm sure they are not the majority. I think most
people are adding plants to their fish tanks rather than adding fish to
their plant tanks. I always plan fish-first. Recently, plants are getting
more and more important to me, though.
My personal impression is that plant people (Well, this term is not correct,
since I know most of them also have fish tanks...) are either more
experienced aquarists or real plant specialists who started their aquarium
hobby not for the fish but for the water-green scenary.
As for his "nature aquarium" concept, Japan has tradition of making mimic
nature rather than arranging things freely. (For example, Japanese
gardens, bonsai, etc.) So, "nature aquarum" is rather familiar concept
to us.
But, I have to admit Amano-san's works are artistic, and sometimes
unusual. Since we have a lot of chances to see neat "nature aquarium"
photos, I'm sure many aquarists are trying to imitate them.
> Is "high technology" used much in Japanese planted aquariums?
CO2 injection systems seems to be popular among plant people. I recall
someone (the author of an article for plant beginners in a magazine)
even mentioned that CO2 injection and shrimps had become "common sense"
for today's plant aquarium. But, CO2 injection systems are expensive.
Recently, a product named "Liquid CO2" is introduced to the market.
"Liquid CO2" comes in amples such as some fertilizer for pot flowers.
Hiroshi Yamada (the author of the plant book which someone introduced
when he made some addition to your plant name list.) experimented this
and got good result. I've got one and used. But, I don't know this
really work, since I don't have enough skill to keep other factors
stable.
Substrate heating cables are not popular yet. Some advanced people
seem to have started to use very recently.
I think chillers and RO units are very rare. They are still very
expensive. And, as for the RO units, Japanese water is not so hard.
(But, is getting worse...)
Best regards,
-Shinji Egi
==========================
~From: Shinji Egi
~Subject: Correction
~Date: Mon, 29 Aug 94 18:30:52 JST
I'm sorry I made 2 errors in the mails I sent to you:
> By the way, he arranges 20 or so "nature aquarium" a month.
It was from my odd memory... Amano-san said that he arranged 20 "nature
aquarium" in the last 2 months in the note in recent issue of AquaLife
magazine. He had also stated that he had been arranging 50-60 "nature
aquarium" a year in another issue of AquaLife a couple of months before
that. Probably, the number is increasing for the ADA's monthly magazine
"Aqua Journal".
> Recently, a product named "Liquid CO2" is introduced to the market.
> "Liquid CO2" comes in amples such as some fertilizer for pot flowers.
The product name is "CO2 Liquid". And it comes in ampUles. One ampule
is for 55-75 liters of (probably, densely planted) water and the supplier
claims that it provides for 14 days as much constant CO2 level as "forced
injection" does. (This sounds too much for me...)
The supplier also claims that it also works for aquariums with hang-over
type filter which drops back the filtered water (thus, tend to dissolve
O2 at that time).
3 ampules are priced 1,200yen and sold at 950yen ($9.70). I don't think
this price is low. But, seems reasonable for 57-liter tanks for
experimenting CO2 injection handy, before considering it seriously.
(I will try DIY CO2 generation after that. But, I have to be able to
maintain the plants in the 57-liter more healthy before all of these
experiments. So I need to investigate some test kits, for now, to check
what's happening to my plants.)
Aqua Journal
------------
This weekend, I visited 3 aquarium shops seeking bee shrimps (no luck),
good plant books (no luck again), and some fertilizer to provide Fe++
to my plants. (This is my first attempt of feeding a special thing to
plants. And boy, plants look like regaining color immediately!)
One of the shops carries the ADA products and also Aqua Journal.
I've got all 3 issues of Aqua Journal. All the 3 issues are thin (less
than 40 pages) and do not have a lot of good information, so far.
I've got all 3 issues of Aqua Journal.
(For the fertilizer, I bought Dupla. ADA's "Nature Aquarium Goods" are
high-end products, thus expensive.)
One interesting series exists, however, which pick up some of the ADA
products and discuss what problem has lead ADA (or Amano-san) to develop
such products. While this is obviously advertisement of their products,
there is some information such as I wanted to have in my "good plant
books", too. (It seems that the plant FAQ covers what I want fairly
well.)
Aqua Journal Vol.2 picked up the "gravel system" which might be
interesting for you. What makes their "gravel system" special are:
(1)Power Sand
ADA recommends putting this sand under the regular gravel. It
contains peat-compost which will effect very slowly.
(I'm not sure about the peat-compost, but several brands of plant
sands have come to market by many suppliers recently.)
(2)bacteria seeding
ADA sells bacteria seed which helps plants by converting materials
into the form that plants can consume. This powder should be mixed
into Power Sand.
(3)Growth Plate
This is a aluminum plate which is intended for heating gravel from
the whole bottom. The front is thin and back is thick. A regular
heater should be put in the hole at the back. There are a couple
of linear projections on the surface (to prevent the gravel from
slipping?).
ADA claims that this is better than the substrate heating line
which produces unevenness of the gravel temperature.
I also found one additional information in Aqua Journal Vol.3 about
shrimps. Shrimps are more sensitive to excess CO2 than fish. So,
ADA recommends to observe shrimps to check if the CO2 is too much.
(They are usually busy picking things up to their mouth. And, at CO2
excess, are dull or stop moving the arms.)
Best regards,
- Shinji Egi
==========================
~From: Shinji Egi
~Subject: Your questions
~Date: Tue, 30 Aug 94 18:44:29 JST
> > (For the fertilizer, I bought Dupla. ADA's "Nature Aquarium Goods" are
> > high-end products, thus expensive.)
Well, another (and probably more significant) reason I bought Dupla is that
they had small-amount ones, and they clearly claimed on the package that
they supply Fe++ by that product.
As for ADA, I was not sure which ADA product meet my requirement. ADA's
liquid fertilizer line-up includes ones for ~3months, 3~12months, 12months~,
for "positive" plants (such as Riccia), "negative" plants (such as
Cryptocoryne), special additive for "K", ...
Unfortunately, I'm not sure what I can provide by some cheaper domestic
fertilizer. (Some information may be available in their ads in magazines,
though.) Most aquarium chemicals do not have lists of contents in Japan.
This is one proof that Japanese laws do not intend to protect consumers.
> It is surprising to hear about a product that makes Dupla seem
> "reasonable". I have used Dupla fertilizers other products for close
> to 7 years now and people always gasp when they hear what they cost
> compared to Tetra products. But at least they work.
Tetra products are probably the most popular in Japan. And Tetra substrate
fertilizers are also recommended by magazines. This time I forgot to check
Tetra products, just because the shop didn't have them around where I looked
in... Next time, I will try to save money.
Best Regards,
- Shinji Egi
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
George Booth "The power of accurate observation is
booth-at-hplvec.lvld.hp.com commonly called cynicism by those who
Freshwater Plant Tank Technology have not got it" - George Bernard Shaw.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
by jkelly-at-landau.ucdavis.edu (Jim Kelly)
Date: 12 Oct 1994
Newsgroup: sci.aquaria
I just saw a copy of Takashi Amano's "Nature Aquarium World". This is
a TFH book, but ignore the publisher. This book has the best pictures
of planted aquaria I've EVER seen. Innes Schuermann's photos are nothing!
While the technical info is somewhat underdone, one thing is made clear:
there exists an algae eating shrimp which he calls "yamato-numaebi" which
far outperforms any living thing for algae control. This includes
C Siamensis. He calls it "algae control agent number one." If you look
closely in his photos they are everywhere, and there is never a spot of
algae! A similar looking shrimp appears on the inside front cover
of Schuuermann's book (recent edition).
I must have these shrimp!!
George mentioned (I believe) the existence of such an animal a while back
but as I recall it was pooh-poohed. Amano indicates they are widespread
in use (at least in Japan) and that keeping an aquarium spotless is
difficult without them.
Does anyone have any leads or know someone who might be able to import
them (I believe they are Japan natives).
Jim Kelly
jkelly-at-landau.ucdavis.edu
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From: Neil.Frank-at-launchpad.unc.edu (Neil Frank)
Newsgroups: sci.aquaria
Subject: Re: [Plant] AMAZING ALGAE EATING SHRIMP: SEEN IT?
Date: 14 Oct 1994 11:37:52 GMT
Organization: The University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill, the Experimental Bulletin Board Service.
Lines: 57
Message-ID: <37lqig$qii-at-bigblue.oit.unc.edu>
References: <37hivh$opf-at-mark.ucdavis.edu>
NNTP-Posting-Host: lambada.oit.unc.edu
Originator: launch-at-lambada
In article <37hivh$opf-at-mark.ucdavis.edu>,
Jim Kelly <jkelly-at-landau.ucdavis.edu> wrote:
>I just saw a copy of Takashi Amano's "Nature Aquarium World". This is
>a TFH book, but ignore the publisher. This book has the best pictures
>of planted aquaria I've EVER seen. Innes Schuermann's photos are nothing!
>While the technical info is somewhat underdone, one thing is made clear:
>there exists an algae eating shrimp which he calls "yamato-numaebi"
Consistent with most TFH books, the text sucks. In this case, the problem
is more with the translation. Yumato-numaebi means Japanese (Yumato) -
marsh (numa) - ebi (shrimp). That is what I learned when I visited with
Amano. He was not amused at the poor translation. His current book
will not get translated. He published it in Japanese and English. The
pictures are better than the first.
which
>far outperforms any living thing for algae control. This includes
>C Siamensis. He calls it "algae control agent number one."
This is true. There are hardly any SAE in Japan or Taiwan. Almost almost
all must go to EuropeI, except for the few which go to Albany CA :-).
> If you look
>closely in his photos they are everywhere, and there is never a spot of
>algae!
Very true. During my recent trip, I probably took 1 roll of slides just
on the shrimp. Another 10 rolls on the most amazing planted aquaria. Asia
may soon be ahead of Europe, if not already there. The big drawback to
these shrimp is that they cannot be used as effective algae eaters with
fish who like to eat them :-) I beleive the shop keepers may throw in
a large amount over night, so they can do their job and become a tasty
breakfast the next morning.
... comments to be continued. I need to stop here and check if this post will
be accepted, so I do not waste my time typing on line.
.........................................................................
A similar looking shrimp appears on the inside front cover
>of Schuuermann's book (recent edition).
>
>I must have these shrimp!!
>
>George mentioned (I believe) the existence of such an animal a while back
>but as I recall it was pooh-poohed. Amano indicates they are widespread
>in use (at least in Japan) and that keeping an aquarium spotless is
>difficult without them.
>
>Does anyone have any leads or know someone who might be able to import
>them (I believe they are Japan natives).
>
>Jim Kelly
>jkelly-at-landau.ucdavis.edu
>
--
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From: Neil.Frank-at-launchpad.unc.edu (Neil Frank)
Newsgroups: sci.aquaria
Subject: Re: [Plant] AMAZING ALGAE EATING SHRIMP: SEEN IT?
Date: 14 Oct 1994 11:52:44 GMT
Organization: The University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill, the Experimental Bulletin Board Service.
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Originator: launch-at-lambada
In article <37hivh$opf-at-mark.ucdavis.edu>,
Jim Kelly <jkelly-at-landau.ucdavis.edu> wrote:
>I just saw a copy of Takashi Amano's "Nature Aquarium World". This is
>a TFH book, but ignore the publisher. This book has the best pictures
>of planted aquaria I've EVER seen. Innes Schuermann's photos are nothing!
>While the technical info is somewhat underdone, one thing is made clear:
>there exists an algae eating shrimp which he calls "yamato-numaebi" which
>far outperforms any living thing for algae control. This includes
>C Siamensis. He calls it "algae control agent number one." If you look
>closely in his photos they are everywhere, and there is never a spot of
>algae! A similar looking shrimp appears on the inside front cover
>of Schuuermann's book (recent edition).
Very observant. I definitely missed this. It definitely looks like
one of the shrimp seen is Asia. There are several species native there.
From my new Japanese book, they are called Caridina and Neocaridina species
and are 2-5 cm. (1-2inches). They are different than the glass (ghost)
shrimp which are native in U.S. I have a few of these to try, but
I do not have enough algae to do a good test. I have
asked a local shop to dump some in with a tank of red algae. When I find
out, I will report to *.aquaria.
>
>I must have these shrimp!!
>
>George mentioned (I believe) the existence of such an animal a while back
>but as I recall it was pooh-poohed.
George probably pooh-poohed it, but you know George is never serious :-)
Amano indicates they are widespread
>in use (at least in Japan) and that keeping an aquarium spotless is
>difficult without them.
Especially since he and others in Japan love to use dense plantings on
the bottom, like submerged riccia.
>
>Does anyone have any leads or know someone who might be able to import
>them (I believe they are Japan natives).
I will look into this. But I suspect that unless they ship well and
I order a container load, the cost will be unreasonable.
I do not think they will breed in aquaria.
>
>Jim Kelly
>jkelly-at-landau.ucdavis.edu
>
--
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Launchpad is an experimental internet BBS. The views of its users do not
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by hougen-at-femto.cs.umn.edu (Dean Hougen)
Date: Sun, 25 Jun 1995
Newsgroup: alt.aquaria
In article <3scvbe$rec-at-news.service.uci.edu>,
Guest User <root-at-orion.oac.uci.edu> writes:
>I bought some scuds (tiny freshwater shrimp) from the live foods supplier
>advertised in the fish magazine. These creatures multiplied very fast and
>now they are in all the tanks in my house. However, none of my fish could
>catch them because they swim so fast and disappear in the water plants.
>In addition, they have hard exoskeleton, so I think it might be tough for
>fish to digest them. Do any of you know the kind of fish that can eat
>those scuds. May be I was tricked by the suppliers.
I purchased a bag of scuds from a local retailer and fed them to a
tank of medium-sized South American cichlids (think Aequidens) a month
or two ago. They gobbled them up in no time. Even the 2" juveniles
went for them.
What I didn't realize was that they were so easy to reproduce (since my
fish ate them so fast). I take it you didn't do anything special to
reproduce them. Tell me about your general set up. I might try
setting up a tank to breed these in sometime in the future.
Dean Hougen
--
"When can I meet them?" "After you've eaten." - Jim Morrison
by George Booth <booth-at-hpmtlgb1.lvld.hp.com>
Date: Tue, 30 May 1995
I received the following from an acquaintance in Japan (who I'm
trying to convince to join the mailing list):
> From: Shinji Egi
>
> At the beginning of this month, I had a chance to go to the shop which
> deals with the Amano's [author of _Nature_World_Aquarium_] products. I
> checked that the question about the water circulation in the substrate
> which I mailed to ADA last year had been ignored.
>
> I found that Amano wrote in one of the Aqua Journal the story of
> discovery of the Yamato-numaebi as algae eater. It goes:
>
> He noticed that some shrimps do pretty good algae-eating job. So, he
> asked an dealer to gather all the domestic shrimps and crayfish. And
> tried all of them. He set some checklist to evaluate them - such as
> algae-eating efficiency, compatibility, ...
> Yamato-numaebi was almost entirely satisfactory. Amano asked the dealer
> to gather as much Yamato-numaebi as he can. The dealer was doubtful
> that the shrimps sold well. But, Amano was confident. And today,...
>
> So, at least Amano says that it is he who first intrduced that shrimp
> as algae eater.
>
> By the way, I've got 15 bee-shrimps at that shop. They are about 1cm
> long now. I think they are not so sufficient algae eaters. Probably
> a Yamato-numaebi worth 5 or so bee-shrimps as algae eater.
> I'm going to keep the bee-shrimps anyway, since I need algae eaters
> compatible with small killifish which seems not compatible with
> Yamato-numaebi. I would breed the bee-shrimps and see if they work
> well when the population gets huge.
>
> Regards,
> -Shinji
George
by Neale Monks <N.Monks-at-nhm.ac.uk>
Date: 20 Jul 1995
Newsgroup: rec.aquaria
Kjell,
At least in the UK, freshwater shrimps sold in pet stores fall into two
groups. First (and commonest) are basically estuarine, native prawns
collected as live food. Genera include Palaemon and Leander. Basically
hardy, they do well in warm tanks for some time. I've kept them in
coral-reef tanks with some success. Called grass shrimps, glass shrimps,
brown shrimps...all sorts of names. Similar species worldwide. Also
found in tanks are Gammarus species. These are little woodlouse-looking
creatures, often seen in garden ponds.
Secondly are the various freshwater shrimps imported from South East
Asia as novelties. Forget about latin names...I've tried to classify
prawns for marine surveys, and it's TOUGH. Only one is really easy,
Macrobranchus. This is a very large shrimp, about 10cm long or more, and
the males have very large pincers. There is also a frequently imported
filter feeding shrimp, which has four modified arms it uses to feed,
which look like tiny, hairy, fans. No idea what it is called, but seems
quite hardy and grows quickly.
Most marine shrimps have planktonic larvae, and are very difficult to
raise. Some marine and estuarine shrimps carry the eggs around, but the
larvae still hatch as planktonic animals, not miniature shrimps. True
freshwater shrimps raise the babies beneath the legs until they are able
to fend for themselves. These are not planktonic larvae, but are very
small and difficult to raise. Try putting the brooding parent into a
breeding trap. When the eggs hatch they will need minute algae, pond
water would be ideal. Basically, treat them as if you were raising
Artemia (brine shrimp), in an algae rich medium with gentle aeration.
Liquid invertebrate food would also be useful.
Good luck!
Neale Monks, Department of Palaeontology,
Natural History Museum, London, SW7 5BD
Internet: N.Monks-at-nhm.ac.uk
Telephone: 0171-938-9007
by dwebb-at-ti.com (David Webb)
Date: Mon, 04 Dec 95
> Can somebody tell me which choice to take?
>
>a - buy like mad, those ghost shrimp are unbelievable!
>
>b - pass on those little shrimp imposters, they are not the real ones.
c - Ghost shrimp do eat algae, but you need a lot of them to get rid of lots of
algae.
They're nice to have, but they don't grow to adulthood particularly fast, and
they make very good fish food if you have fish that might be interested. They
also tend to get stuck in filtration systems that have a small inlet.
>From what I can tell, ghost shrimp will eat just about any kind of algae, but
they have very definite preferences. They also will choose fish food just
about any day over algae.
If you want to "breed" them, get a few females that are laden with eggs. Put
them in a big tank with lots of hiding places. A few months later, you'll see
tiny shrimp in your tank if you look hard enough (and if they don't get stuck
in the filter). I have a load of juveniles in a 10g tank with 7x24 lighting.
The water is green and cloudy, and the shrimp appear to like it that way.
They love dried daphnia.
David W. Webb
Enterprise Computing Provisioning
Texas Instruments Inc. Dallas, TX USA
(214) 575-3443 (voice) MSGID: DAWB
(214) 575-4853 (fax) Internet: dwebb-at-ti.com
(214) 581-2380 (pager) Text Pager: pgr-at-ti.com Subj:PAGE:David Webb
by Shinji Egi <egi-at-hpycla.kobe.hp.com>
Date: Wed, 6 Dec 95
Sorry for the late response.
Hardjono wrote:
> Just in case you have not seen the famous algae eating shrimp, Practical
> Fishkeeping (PFK) magazine has a close up picture of it in the Dec '95
> issue (p. 96). It's a pretty creature. Apparently there are quite a few
> UK stores have them. The article has a list of those stores. The retail
> price is 2.95 pounds ea. It's very effective in cleaning up algae from
> plants but not on the tank glass.
It's nice to hear that they managed to travel to UK.
> Has somebody (in UK or Japan) has first hand experience with this shrimp ?
Yes, I do. In Japan, most algae cleaning agents for planted tanks usually
consist of those shrimps and otocinclus. (And SAE's are hard to find
around where I live, while all the shops deal with those shrimps.)
I have no idea what people in UK think about the price 2.95 pounds ea.
The price around here is -at-150yen now. (used to be -at-200yen a while back)
Anyway, Yamato-Numaebi's are certainly good algae eaters, IMHO.
I personally love to hear from people who tried both SAE and those shrimps
what they think of both of them in comparison, and compatibility between
them.
Here's my review of Yamato-Numaebi:
(1)Algae-eating ability
- I found they eat green stringy algae very well.
- They do eat red algae, but I believe they don't like it very much.
- As for cleaning up algae from the tank glass, other algae eaters such
as sucker-mouth catfish (farlowella, otocinclus, etc) do far better job.
(2)Compatibility
- Keeping with bigger fish (anything bigger than adult angel fish) should
be avoided.
(3)Breeding
- Hard.
I often see some of them carrying eggs, without any special care.
And once I had the eggs hatch in a shrimps-and-java-moss tank.
The difficult part is feeding the plankton shrimps until they settle
down on plants as tiny shrimps. (I haven't done this, yet)
They eat micro creatures which live in brackish water in natural habitat.
(4)Environment
- pH 7.0 (should be 6.5-)
- Temp 10-28C (should be -28C)
- Lots of dissolved O2.
(5)Feeding
- Nothing should be fed for them (especially when tankmates are fed).
They are good scavengers, too. And, prefer fish food to algae.
By the way, I believe they can live on algae (or plants?) only.
So, I would suggest no fish plant tank with yamato-numaebi for people
who can enjoy it.
For people who tests other shrimps, I would like to suggest no feeding
in a plant tank with no fish. And, please make sure to report the result.
- Shinji from Kobe, Japan
by "Roger S. Miller" <rgrmill/rt66.com>
Date: Thu, 11 Dec 1997
>
> I have also gotten these same shrimp at 8 for $1 and while they do eat my
> algae very well, they always die after a few weeks in my tanks, no matter
> which tank they are in. No one picks on them and they really clean up on
> the algae. I was wondering if very low KH and GH might be causing
> problems with their exoskeleton formation?
>
> Any ideas?
>
I've kept ghost shrimp, bumble bee shrimp and grass shrimp, and had pretty
similar experiences with all of them. Sometimes they'd live long enough
to molt once or twice. I started dosing their tank with iodide, using the
SeaChem product for marine tanks. Since then I've only kept grass shrimp,
but they've lived almost a year now.
Roger Miller
by mark.fisher/tpwd.state.tx.us
Date: Thu, 11 Dec 97
>I have also gotten these same shrimp at 8 for $1 and while they do
>eat my algae very well, they always die after a few weeks in my
>tanks, no matter which tank they are in. No one picks on them and
>they really clean up on the algae. I was wondering if very low KH
>and GH might be causing problems with their exoskeleton formation?
If your shrimp are dying immediately after or during a molt, then I
would suspect low calcium. Crustaceans have the ability to conserve
and store calcium, though, so your water would have to be practically
calcium-free for this to occur. Also, many eat their discarded
exoskeletons as a means of reclaiming lost nutrients.
Otherwise, I suspect you may have a brackish/saltwater species,
probably Palaemonetes vulgaris or P. pugio, aka grass shrimp. These
are two common species found along the Atlantic and Gulf coasts; one
can literally collect hundreds of these shrimp with a a seine along
any coastal marsh, with little effort.
These shrimp have a high tolerance for fresh water, but cannot survive
there permanently.
Kind regards,
Mark
by Rhonda Wilson <rhondawi/sprynet.com>
Date: Fri, 30 Jan 1998
Raymond,
> Hello again
> I have these shrimps.....The problem now is that i see some of
> them are pregnant.Help me please.
These are great little shrimp. They reproduce very well in fish tanks, the problem is
like most fish the offspring are small and
looked on by other inhabitants to be choice food. I've found the best way to get more
baby shrimp is to keep them in tanks with lots
of ground cover plants, with less aggresive fish and well fed tanks. They do real
well for me with livebearers in heavily planted
tanks, especially tanks that have a carpet of micranthemum.
Rhonda
by "Shiao Y. Wang" <sywang/whale.st.usm.edu>
Date: Sat, 31 Jan 1998
The gentleman with gravid shrimp should place the shrimp in a separate
container. Try to prevent temperature shock. An easy way to avoid the
problem is to float a shoe-box size plastic container in the tank for
holding the shrimp while you set something up more permanent. The
container does not need substrate but a piece of plastic plant or
something similar will provide something for the shrimp to hold onto.
You can roughly gauge the stage of development by the color of the eggs.
They should start out ranging in color from olive green to orange. They
get darker with development and should be brown to black prior to
hatching. The larvae will be planktonic and can be fed newly hatched
brine shrimp. Note that I don't know which species of shrimp you have in
Singapore and am speaking based on experience with palaeomonids in the
U.S. Good luck and best wishes.
- --
Shiao Y. Wang
University of Southern Mississippi
by Calvin Chin <calvinchin/letterbox.com>
Date: Wed, 11 Mar 1998
I have about 50 of these shrimp in my tank. I believe Amano calls them "Bee
shrimp". So far, left alone, they have successfully bred in both my tanks.
Generally, I think they consume small algae and are scavengers as well.
The other type of shrimp used by Amano is the 'Yamato shrimp'. I have about
5 large specimens of this type and they are more costly than the Bee shrimp
here in Singapore (6 times the price. A Bee shrimp retails for about 25
Singapore cents while the yamato costs S$1.50). The Yamato shrimp is good
for eating green filamentous hair algae, the type Dupla says indicate
optimum conditions for plants. However, no one has bred them here before,
although a friend and fellow plant enthusiast, Kwek Leong, has got
specimens full of roe.
Besides these two types of shrimp, we also have the Taiwanese black shelled
shrimp and another type of Malaysian shrimp with a light brown stripe along
its back. They cost the same as the bee shrimp. I have these in my tank too
and they seem to do the same job as the bee shrimp.
>From: "A. Inniss" <andrewi-at-u.washington.edu>
>Subject: Caridina japonica/quartz binds Fe?
>
> I have access to what I believe are the same shrimp we see in
>Amano's photographs (C. japonica, if I remember right). I'm wondering
>whether anyone on the list has kept them, and what recommendations they
>might have. I would be particularly interested in any breeding info.
>They're not cheap, running about $4.50, but if these are the right shrimp,
>and they are as good at eating algae as is said, then I'd be willing to
>shell out the $$$.
>
Calvin Chin
by khewss/singnet.com.sg (Khew Sin Sun)
Date: Sat, 14 Mar 1998
>rather short, and they don't eat red algae. I'm hoping that the Yamato
>numa-ebi will at least live longer
Andrew,
just a note on these Yamatos....
I brought 100 back from Japan in June last year (cost about US$1 each
then). I can say that i've still got about 25% of them left after nearly 1
year. Which kinda gives u an idea that they can live for at least a year or
more! :-)
Besides,these survivors are now about 2inches in size!!! I've seen them
with eggs under the females many a times but from what i heard,they seem to
breed in marine environment.:-(
Khew
================================
http://www.singnet.com.sg/~khewss/
================================
by bae/cs.toronto.edu (Beverly Erlebacher)
Date: 20 Apr 98
Newsgroup: alt.aquaria
In article <35380108.C86E8FB-at-concentric.net>,
Tom <thaifarm-at-concentric.net> wrote:
>Forget about try'g to breed them in your fish tank. They'll need speciallize
>breed'g tank w/ "green water" and very low filtration, preferably no filtration at
>all other than let algaes do all the work. They'll also need very hard water with
>neutral pH.(I also heard that they'll breed in very soft water too, not sure if it
>a same type of shrimp or not).
I had a little colony going in a 15 gallon tank for about 3 or 4 generations.
I used my tap water which isn't particularly hard ( 7-8 GH) or alkaline
(pH 7.5). It seems to me that these critters are detritivores - they will
eat just about anything, including algae and flake food. I had some floating
plants and they spent a lot of time moving aroudn in them picking off bits of
debris and eating it.
>> I just realized one of my ghost shrimp has eggs(??) inside of it. I put her in
>> a small plastic fish breeding container that sits inside the tank to keep her
>> away from the other fish. But my question is do ghost shrimp even lay eggs or
>> are they livebearers? Do the eggs need to be fertilized by a male? If anyone
>> knows anything about ghost shrimp let me know.
The female lays the eggs and attaches them to her swimmerets, the feather
like appendages under her tail. They remain there until they are fairly
well developed, then drop off. I'm under the impression that the female
mates and stores sperm until she is ready to lay, and the eggs are fertilized
as they are released, but I haven't seen them laying, just mating.
Some people have posted that the eggs hatch into planktonic larvae. This
may be true of marine and possibly some freshwater or brackish shrimp, but
not of the species I had. When released from the female's swimmerets, they
stayed in the gravel, and as far as I could tell, had the form of an adult
shrimp, just smaller.
by bae/cs.toronto.edu (Beverly Erlebacher)
Date: 20 Apr 98
Newsgroup: alt.aquaria
In article <35380108.C86E8FB-at-concentric.net>,
Tom <thaifarm-at-concentric.net> wrote:
>Forget about try'g to breed them in your fish tank. They'll need speciallize
>breed'g tank w/ "green water" and very low filtration, preferably no filtration at
>all other than let algaes do all the work. They'll also need very hard water with
>neutral pH.(I also heard that they'll breed in very soft water too, not sure if it
>a same type of shrimp or not).
I had a little colony going in a 15 gallon tank for about 3 or 4 generations.
I used my tap water which isn't particularly hard ( 7-8 GH) or alkaline
(pH 7.5). It seems to me that these critters are detritivores - they will
eat just about anything, including algae and flake food. I had some floating
plants and they spent a lot of time moving aroudn in them picking off bits of
debris and eating it.
>> I just realized one of my ghost shrimp has eggs(??) inside of it. I put her in
>> a small plastic fish breeding container that sits inside the tank to keep her
>> away from the other fish. But my question is do ghost shrimp even lay eggs or
>> are they livebearers? Do the eggs need to be fertilized by a male? If anyone
>> knows anything about ghost shrimp let me know.
The female lays the eggs and attaches them to her swimmerets, the feather
like appendages under her tail. They remain there until they are fairly
well developed, then drop off. I'm under the impression that the female
mates and stores sperm until she is ready to lay, and the eggs are fertilized
as they are released, but I haven't seen them laying, just mating.
Some people have posted that the eggs hatch into planktonic larvae. This
may be true of marine and possibly some freshwater or brackish shrimp, but
not of the species I had. When released from the female's swimmerets, they
stayed in the gravel, and as far as I could tell, had the form of an adult
shrimp, just smaller.
by shine/cbnewsh.cb.att.com (stephen.c.shine)
Date: 9 Jan 92
Newsgroup: rec.aquaria
In article sik-at-grosz.esd.sgi.com (Seth Katz) writes:
>While shopping at an oriental market last
>night I saw live "grass shrimp" for sale.
>They were out of water, but, indeed, alive.
>They are colorless and about 2" long.
>
>Anyone know if these are fresh water creatures,
>and if I can keep them, and/or use them as feed?
They're brackish creatures, but I've seen them kept
alive in freshwater for a couple of weeks (in my
tanks) and even months (says a local petstore that
sells them).
They are an excellent form of food, either diced or
whole, for just about anything.
Steve Shine
AT&T Bell Labs
(908)949-8517
att!cbnewsh!shine
att!hoqub!shine
by Hong Sungmin <pongpong/mail.taegu.net>
Date: Thu, 29 Oct 1998
I've been thought that Yamatos eat only green algae.
As you know, they like fish food the most, but when they are starved they eat green
algae.
Many people say S.A.E is the only fish which eat brush algae, but last night I saw Yamoto
do that.
In that tank, their is almost no algae but BBA.
Tank master use plastic-cliff(rock shaped) for back wall, and great amount of BBA
attachs it.
Yamatos usually grab and cut off algae and eat it, but last night Yamatos even didn't use
their hands(?). They just sticked to the back wall(with lots of BBA) and ate BBA with
their mouths directly.
Now I think Yamatos are really starved they eat BBA.
Any comment?
Forgive my poor English...
- ---- Sungmin from S.Korea ------
by "Ryan Stover" <fishboy/neotown.com>
Date: Wed, 4 Nov 1998
Due to the latest interest in the Japanese swamp shrimp I have decided to
write this mini-FAQ's. My knowledge is based on a few different aquarium
magazine that I have bought here in Japan. My wife, Hiromi, has helped me
with the translation.
History:
As the name implies Japanese swamp shrimp come from many different swamp
here in Japan. The photographer, artist, author, and aquarist Takashi Amano
was the first one in the world to use this type of shrimp. I believe he
started using them in the early 80's. Now no tank he creates would be
complete without these little guys.
Diet:
Numa-ebi(meaning swamp shrimp in Japanese)have been known to eat almost
every kind of algae known to aquarist. But ebi are finicky when it come to
how much of what type to eat. One algae that ebi do not like is the dreaded
black beard algae. These shrimp are most active at night, but seem to do a
decent job during the day too. Even if there is an abundance of algae in the
tank I have observed these shrimp tank fish food from the surface of the
water. In extreme case C. japonica has been known to even eat plants. I have
witnessed them eat my nice lawn of Riccia.
Description:
C. japonica can get to almost 2 inches from nose to tail. Body color
consists mostly of a light brown opaque color. On the back carapace there is
a tan stripe that runs from the head down to its tail. On the shrimps side
flanks are a series of broken lateral line that are a reddish-brown in
color. The tail may also contain two or more black dots.
Care and breeding:
Japanese swamp shrimp are very tolerant when it come to water types. Since
they come from swamps they can also tolerate different salinity's. Another
parameter that is tolerated is pH. Amano uses them and his pH is about 6.5
with the Aqua Soil. And since C. japonica originates from a swampy/marsh
region with brackish condition I would guess that a pH well above 7 is also
fine. Two thing to point out is that Yamato numa-ebi are very sensitive to
ammonia/ammonium, and heavy metals. Heavy metals will interfere with the
shrimps molting process causing them to die. Ammonia and ammonium are just
poisonous to all living thing. Other than these simple rule C. japonica
require no other special needs.
Breeding C. japonica on the other hand is certainly a challenge. According
to Aqua World magazine(March,98)no one has breed them in the confines of an
aquarium. Even the conditions and factors regarding breeding is unknown. It
is speculated that C. japonica might spawn, or what ever crustacean do, in
brackish/saltwater and then return to freshwater or vise-versa. The mating
season seems to be in late Spring or early Summer. I base this on the fact
that I have bought C. japonica during these time with big females holding
eggs. One female held this clutch of eggs for about a week after I bought
her. After that time I did not see the eggs again. I looked in the tank for
baby ebi but found none. This is the same thing that happened to the other
females that were holding eggs.
I have a question for Mr. Burke Harris(APD V3 #620). Where do you plan on
getting these shrimp that you want to breed? I thought that C. japonica
could not be imported into America and Canada. Please correct me if I am
wrong.
And since I am on the topic of Japan and Amano I might as well answer a
question by Kelly Beard(APD V3 #621. Kelly was wondering if Amano tank "are
only constructed to take a pretty picture and then be torn down". The answer
is no. Amano's tanks are all set-up for long term use. It might be true that
he capture the tank during its pinnacle, but none the less they are all
set-up for long term beauty.
I hope this has helped some of you who have been wondering about Caridina
japonica. Feel free to post more question about Amano and his products. I am
certainly no expert, but I have been using them for four years mostly due to
the high cost of Dupla here.
Ryan
------------------------------
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by "Roger S. Miller" <rgrmill/rt66.com>
Date: Wed, 2 Dec 1998
On Wed, 2 Dec 1998, Jason Miller wrote:
>
> Will ghost shrimp eat fish fry? I was planning on purchasing some
> from DADS this weekend to put into one of my apisto tanks to keep hair
> algae down, but I don't want them eating my baby apistos.
Ghost shrimp are primarily scavengers, not real herbivores. If they can
catch fish fry (not very likely, really) they probably will eat them. I
keep ghost shrimp with guppies and have never seen them catch a baby
guppy.
In a tank where you're feeding enough to raise fry there will probably be
a lot of food around for the ghost shrimp to eat without resorting to
grazing on the algae. I wouldn't expect the ghost shrimp to do much to
keep your algae problem down.
Roger Miller
by "Ryan Stover" <fishboy/neotown.com>
Date: Wed, 25 Nov 1998
David W. Webb wrote
<<I would expect your botias to eat any invertebrates, including shrimp.>>
I have a full grown clown loach, and 15 Yamato numa-ebi in one of my
planted tanks and they get along great. My loach spends most of the time
hiding, so he doesn't even notice the shrimp. Sometimes when I throw in a
TabiMin for the ebi the loach will come out and chase off the ebi, but no
real conflict. Some of the bigger ebi will even stand there ground against
some medium cichlid like Microgeophagus altispinosa. Now these are the
'Ammano Shrimp' not ghost shrimp, you might have a different situation.
Ryan
by krandall/world.std.com
Date: Fri, 18 Dec 1998
>4 shrimps bought as "Singapore Shrimp" (also from PETsMART)
>and seen as "Wood Shrimp" at the local Meijer's. These are
>roughly 2 inches and have mainly flesh-colored bodies with striping.
>Doing great and eating mostly fish food in a 15 gallon River Tank
>with spotted floating frogs.
I'm not sure about your other shrimp, but I do know this one. I assume
these are the filter feeding shrimp where instead of a pair of pincers in
front, they have what appear to be a pair of feather dusters? If so, it is
Atyopsis moluccensis. They are also sold under the name "Thai wood
shrimp". These are really neat critters. They prefer to filter feed, and
will position themselves high in the plants in the flow from a filter or
power head if given the chance. They would also occasionally descend to
the bottom of the tank and forage by stroking the substrate with their
"feather dusters".
At least some of them turn a brilliant orange under good conditions. We
weren't able to play with enough of them to know for sure what brings on
this color change, but considering their territorial behavior both toward
fish and each other, I suspect it's a dominance thing. We never saw more
than one in a tank turn orange, and it was always the shrimp that appeared
to be the head honcho.
The ones I've had never hurt any fish they were with, even fish quite a bit
smaller, but they also didn't take any guff from anyone. They were
territorial, and would case fish away that came too close to "their" spot.
I didn't have much in the way of algae in the tanks we kept them in, so I
can't comment on their algae eating abilities.
In general, they left the plants alone, but I did have one decimate a lawn
of Glossostigma in a 2 1/2G tank when he went without feeding for 10 days
when we were on vacation. In fairness, though, I don't feed heavily, and
he never touched the Glosso until I forced him into it. I wouldn't worry
about them eating plants if they're given any other alternatives.
I don't know the normal life span for these things. I had one that lasted
about 18 months. The other, unfortunately took a walk. :-( We found him
as a crispy critter after he'd been missing for several days. I'll pick
some of these up in a minute when I see them available in my area again.
by Apflanzeneh/webtv.net
Date: Wed, 17 Mar 1999
Although I don't have availability or cost info. I do know that the ones
I bought up here in Vancouver were shipped in from from Florida...so the
source is there somewhere.
The dozen I introduced into my 120 about a year ago have flourished to
no end!!
My last count across the front of the tank was 70!!! I can not see into
the back half of one side of the tank so my guess is that there is way
more than 70 in there. They are obviously enjoying my water conditions.
At one point towards the end of last summer they all dissapeared,there
didn't seem to be that many inthe tank at the time ,and i had thought
that the clown loaches had had there way with them, not so, by november
they showed up again.....in numbers ! Now they are everywhere!! They are
coexisting with some cardina japonica wich are probably 4 times the
size,excellent little scavengers.
I found a japannese page about them ,but can't seem to get into it
anymore,dunno what happened there? It referred to them as chrystal red
shrimp,they looked exactly the same as what I purchased as bumble bee
shrimp.
Good luck with your search!!
Steve
Van. B.C
by "H. Hoekstra" <hugo/greed.nl>
Date: Tue, 23 Mar 1999
>Thanks for the input regarding the 'flower shrimp'. After referring to
>your web site, it looks like I have Wood or Singapore shrimp. The most
>notable feature being the two pair of filter/fan-like appendages used for
>feeding. One of them just molted, so it looks like they must be getting
>enough to eat.
>Tom Petersen
>peter334@tc.umn.edu
They like to eat decaying plant matter. Have a look at it's droppings. They
should be almost cube like, and there should be a LOT of them. The're easily
identifiable and can almost not be confused with fish droppings. This is a
better way of knowing if your shrimp gets enough to eat. Otherwise let some
old leaves in the tank on the bottom.
Best regards,
Hugo Hoekstra
by C88gthdr/aol.com
Date: Fri, 30 Jul 1999
In a message dated 7/29/99 1:01:41 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
Aquatic-Plants-Owner@actwin.com writes:
<< 1) How many do you think should be in my "micro" (2.5 gal) plant tank? The
only other inhabitants are red ramshorn snails. >>
Amano suggests placing 20 of them in a 10 gallon tank (2 shrimps : 1 gallon).
So 5 seems to be about the right number of shrimp for a 2.5 gallon tank.
Keeping too many of them in the absence of an alternative food source will
force them to eat your plants. Keeping too few may increase the likelihood of
an algae outbreak. However, since you won't be adding any fish-food to the
tank, you probably won't get a lot of algae. That means the shrimp won't have
any algae or fish-poo to eat. I'd say 3 or 4 is a very good recommendation.
Yay for your LFS.
<< Is there alot of variation in the coloring/marking of C. japonica shrimp?
>>
Yes. I have fifty of them in a 29 gallon tank. They vary considerably in
coloration and transparency. These qualities tend to change with age. The
yellow line grows more pronounced with age. Moreover, the intensity and size
of the spots on the side of the shrimp vary considerably. I have shrimp with
spots so faint that they are almost undetectable and others with large,
pronounced spots in-line along the length of the shrimp's tail.
Now for my two cents. I love these guys! They eat everything from detritus to
BBA. They are worth every penny. And when you buy fifty of them, those
pennies add up! :)
Dan P
by "Alex" <girardinus/dubouchet.com>
Date: Tue, 26 Oct 1999
On Mon, 25 Oct 1999 14:16:53 -0400 (edt)
Roger S. Miller" <rgrmill@rt66.com> wrote:
>Subject: Re: freshwater invertebrates
>
>You might try Carolina Biological Supply (www3.carolina.com) or other
>scientific or educational supply companies. I haven't bought from
>Carolina Biological, but they are a well-established firm. I checked with
>them this morning and their online catalog lists a variety of freshwater
>inverts.
Roger,
I have ordered ghost shrimp, planaries and protozoans from Carolina Biological Supply several times in the past. They have an excellent service and the live stock has always arrived fresh and healthy. I personally recommend it. They also have a lot of laboratory utensils that are very useful to this hobby.
Alex
Washington, DC
by "Brett Kemker" <bkemker/mailer.fsu.edu>
Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2000
To: <apisto/majordomo.pobox.com>
Vinny-
As you might have suspected, I have raised and bred ghost shrimp.
As you well know, when living in Florida all you need is a dip net for all
of the "grass" shrimp you can handle. Because of this, after I had
successfully bred them and raised young, I designated that tank for other
breeding challenges.
I started with about 20 individuals in a 10-gallon tank. Like Master's
says feed them what you would any fish. I used a spirulina flake because
that is what I was feeding a lot of back in the 80's. I'm sure you remember
those days when I was an African rift lake FANATIC! I found that sponge
filters were the best application in this situation and used a fluorescent
light source to grow algae. Like crawfish (Procambarus sp.), I began to see
the females carry clusters of eggs under their tail. What I wasn't
prepared for was that the once the young hatched they take on a
free-swimming larval form that looks nothing like the parents. I would see
females without eggs and look for the babies and never find them. Upon
closer inspection I finally came to see the schools of shrimp larvae in the
water column. They are extremely small and extremely transparent. Upon
seeing this I added cultured Euglena to the water often enough to keep the
whole tank tinged green and occasionally added powdered flake. The fry
developed and eventually dropped out of the water column. I didn't notice
any predation by the adult shrimp in the tank. But, I soon added fish to
that tank and that was that.
Hope this helps...
Be good to yourself,
Brett
___________________________
Brett Kemker, Ph.D.
Dept. of Communication Disorders
The Florida State University
Tallahassee, Fl. 32306-1200
Ph:850.644.2238
Fax:850.644.8994
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-apisto@admin.listbox.com
[mailto:owner-apisto@admin.listbox.com]On Behalf Of V Kutty
Sent: Monday, February 21, 2000 3:12 PM
To: apisto@majordomo.pobox.com
Subject: Re: Ghost Shrimp Was: Microworms
Does anybody have any tips on raising Ghost (or Grass) shrimp?
These shrimps are GREAT for conditioning dwarf pikes. Everytime I stuff my
pikes with these shrimps, the fish spawn. My aggies and bitaeniata also
love taking bites out of these shrimps. I had a spare 20 with some plants
and algae, so I dumped about a dozen shrimps in there. I have the Charles
O. Masters Encyclopedia of Live Foods and it says feed them what you would
any fish.
Have any of you tried breeding these things?
Vinny
by Scheele Juergen <juesche/earthlink.net>
Date: Fri, 24 Aug 2001
.....rumor has it that the , so called Amano Shrimp in the trade
is by now a HYBRID !
+ adaptation to freshwater
- - infertile eggs
etc.
It would be interesting to find out .
Genetic manipulation, Parrot Chiclids and Tie Dyed Tetras are common in
the trade.
Juergen
by "Karen Randall" <krandall/world.std.com>
Date: Tue, 18 Dec 2001
>Has anyone had success with raising these shrimp?
I used the term reproducing in the subject line, because I sure didn't have
anything to do with intentionally "breeding" them.<g> I also can't tell you
much about HOW I did it. I CAN tell you that last summer, my 125G became
really, really overgrown. Practically CHOKED with plants.
When I finally took a machete to the plants, Amano shrimp came flying out of
the plants as I threw them into a bucket. (side note... it is VERY difficult
to pick these shrimp up off the floor, and they can flip LONG distances!<g>)
I think I put half a dozen in the tank when I first saw them available at a
price I was willing to pay. I never saw them after the first day, so
figured they had been eaten, died, whatever. Well, I picked up close to a
dozen off the floor, so they were doing SOMETHING in there besides eating
algae.<g>
OTOH, I haven't seen them again since. I'm sure that any that are too bold
would be picked off by the pair of angel fish that are now just about full
grown. I think with the lower plant mass, when I weed they are able to get
out of my way before I remove them by mistake!<g>
Karen
by "Edward Venn" <e_venn/hotmail.com>
Date: Wed, 19 Dec 2001
I have various species of Japanese shrimp in my tubs, tanks and what have
you. I think there may be 5 different species in these receptacles.
Amano/japanese Pond Shrimp will thrive under any conditions, theywill
constantly breed if conditions are to their liking. Lots of food, shelter
and good water conditions do wonders. As these shrimp are found throughout
the Kanto Plain and into the Kansai it should be noted that they can survive
any water conditions and a wide range of temperatures. For breeding I use a
large plastic tub filled with plants and basically left alone. A few shrimp
females and a male are placed in this setup and within a space of several
months they will have filled the tank with their offspring. This also works
for other species of shrimp and keeps my fish in live food.
Edward Venn,
SMG Holdings Co., Ltd.,
Deux Chateaux Blanc 2-303,
1356 Kobuchi, Kasukabe,
Saitama, Japan
_________________________________________________________________
MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos:
http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx
by "Tan Kah Cheong" <tankahcheong/pacific.net.sg>
Date: Mon, 16 Jul 2001
> Date: Sun, 15 Jul 2001 20:28:42 -0500
> From: "Alex R." <pcalex@yahoo.com>
> Subject: Re: Trouble with Amano Shrimp - please reply
>
> I have found some more dead shrimp. I think almost half of them died by
now.
> I've also seen a couple of shells. It seems like they might be dying right
> after molting. My calcium is about 50 ppm, so I don't think there is a
> problem with them being able to regrow new shells. Also, there are 6
shrimp
> that won't leave one corner of my tank. It's not an area of particularly
> heavy water flow and there doesn't seem to be more of anything to the
shrimp
> would be interested to eat.
>
> Please reply ASAP. Thank you.
> __
> Alex R.
> pcalex@yahoo.com
Yamato numa-ebi or Amano Shrimp are very sensitive to water condition or
change.
Your biggest mistaken was to dumped them in without the slow process of
letting them get used to your tank water. At this stage if they are still
grouped in one corner meant they are likely to go too. Unless they are very
strong prior to shipping to you.
Well, don't know if it would help now, you might like to do a 50% water
change.
I did manage to save some long time back when I too simply dump them into
the tank.
Good luck!
KC
by Neil Frank <aquarian.subjects/mindspring.com>
Date: Sat, 26 Jan 2002
I just read an interesting article about aquatic plant farms and growing
methods in Singapore and noticed a tidbit of info that may relate to the
thread on dying shrimps a while back. Although the article was written in
1972, the same methods may still be used there:
Diazinon or malathion was sprayed on the plants regularly to keep moths and
beetles off the emersed plants. I will check to see if the same practice is
currently used in the USA. Either way, it is probably a good idea to give
new plants a good soaking (not just a rinse) before they are introduced
into our tanks. This may be more important on the imports which are the
mainstays of many internet plant sellers.
Neil
by Thomas Barr <tcbiii/earthlink.net>
Date: Mon, 28 Jan 2002
> As I recall, Tom Barr was going to do an experiment consisting of ghost
> shrimp versus Amano shrimp versus snails against algae? I would be
> interested in an update. Who is winning?
>
> Daphne
General notions from a couple of tanks:
Well dollar for dollar? The Ghost shrimp. Critter for critter? The Amano's
clearly. @ 0.25 $ each adding 25 to a 20 gallon put me out 6.25$(.20 ea if
sold in lots of 50). Amano's? 25 would cost roughly 15$(if you buy 50).
Amano's are not always available and not everyone is going to get a good
deal on them(some places sell them for 2.99ea etc then it becomes 25 x 2.99=
70+$). Ghost shrimp are everywhere. Very common and always cheap.
Amano's would do a better job. I'm still on the fence about the issue.
Ghostshrimp do seem to eat hydra. At least there none left in the tank that
was chronically infested. My own tanks at home had some hair algae induced
awhile back that had been hanging on after I tossed NH4+ in there(after
removing all the Amano shrimps to other quarters). So the tank had only a
few snails as the algae herbivore crew. Then it became a deposit for extra
trimmings (Riccia, etc) so things had gotten bad and algae was on the march
even with some manual removal.
Adding a bunch of herbivores like these critters does seem to really help
but I also wonder if it's so much from the eating(they do eat the hairalgae
but the waste they excrete in the form of NH4 that keeps things looking
nice. Nice low levels of NH4 with moderate levels of NO3 seem like a great N
combo for the plants.
Two things to consider here:
1)You can look at simply the presence of algae.
2)You can simply look at the plant's growth response.
Both where changed by the addition a noticeable amount IMO.
Two processes are going on here so you need to think about both rather than
just one process when you consider adding the shrimps.
In a heavy fish load tank, you might not get the same result I would think.
I'm not positive or anything on any of this. Just chair side postulations at
this point. I'm a long ways away from any real test.
Regards,
Tom Barr
by Roger Miller <rgrmill/rt66.com>
Date: Tue, 29 Jan 2002
Here's is something that is largely anecdotal.
I have a couple tanks long plagued by a dark green, tough, matt-forming
algae. This stuff has invaded and destroyed three different carpets in
three different tanks. It appeared in a lileaopsis carpet and I did
nothing but mechanical removal. The lileaopsis survived, but no longer as
a carpet. It appeared in a glosso carpet and amano shrimp and American
flag fish didn't touch it. The glosso was wiped out (partly by the Flag
fish). When it appeared in a marsilea carpet I added ruby barbs and they
cleaned it out. SAEs didn't touch the stuff. The barbs also trim the
marsilea and E. tenellus.
More recently I decided to use the full-fertilizer blitz (add all macros
in excess and make sure that iron and other traces are supplied) to see
what the algae would do. In the tank with the lileaposis the algae went
into retreat, but never quite disappeared. It stayed on in clumps here
and there. But it retreated enough that I decided to try and re-stablish
the lileaopsis carpet.
In the tank that once held the glosso there was no effect from the
fertilizer blitz, so I added 6 amano shimp (at ~$4 each) to the 10-gallon
tank. Two disappeared immediately and one disappeared somewhat later.
There are three remaining. I see them grazing through the algae, but the
algae is still there. I still have to mechanically remove the algae to
keep it from carpeting the tank. Maybe those are real Caridina japanica.
A couple weeks ago I noticed that the algae was starting to get into my
re-established lileaposis lawn and from experience I knew that something
had to be done. Friday after work I stopped into the LFS (Clark's on
Lomas) and picked up a dozen mixed-sized ghost shrimp. They were marked
at 3/$0.99, but they actually sold them to me for half that. I added them
to the tank with the lileaopsis and as of this morning (Tuesday) the only
visible algae in that tank was a little green tint just along the front of
the tank at the gravel line. The shimp got down between the blades of
lileaopsis and cleaned out the algae down to the gravel.
I've kept ghost shrimp for years and I regard them as effective,
omnivorous scavengers. They aren't herbivorous, but they do eat some
algae. They'll also eat small fish if they can catch them. I was a
little surprised by the huge effect they had in this tank. I attribute
their effectiveness to a fairly large population (12 shrimp in a 20-gallon
tank), the young age of many of the shrimp and the fact that they just
came from the pet shop. They probably hadn't had much to eat for a long
time.
Will they be able to hold that algae at bay? We'll see. My advice to
anyone who wants to try using them is to use a lot of them.
Roger Miller
The Krib
Fish/Animals
The Krib