The Krib
Apistogramma/Dwarf Cichlids
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The Krib
Apistogramma/Dwarf Cichlids
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Apistogramma agassiziiSee also: A. agassizii spawning article by Phil Ryti, originally written for the Michigan Cichlid Association.Contents:
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Photos by Ken Laidlaw
Photos by Erik Olson
Photo by Doug Brown
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In article <CG6Kvz.D66-at-dnsserv.go.dlr.de> meisner-at-DT2.WTDA writes:
>Did anyone out there ever breed these guys.
Yes, a couple of times.
>I keep them by themselves (with two tiny catfish (Loacridae)) in a 5 Gallon
>tank.
5 gal is too small. I know that Dr. Loiselle claims to have managed to
breed them in a 10 gal tank 2/3 filled with large rocks ("caves" set
up), but my current attempts to breed them in a 10 gal tank are failing
miserably. A few years ago I did well with them in a 40 gal "breeder"
(wide/low) tank and in a "standard" 60 gal.
In my experience the catfish are not desirable tankmates. They
irritate the breeding Apistos and the heavily armored Loricariidae I
tried keeping in the same tank had gotten ito a habit of harassing the
breededs out of their caves and eating the eggs. Small tetras or, as was
the case for one of my set ups, surface-hugging killies (Aplocheilus spp.)
provide an adequate level of dithering. Corydoras catfish may be safe, too.
I seem to recall having a few of those in the tanks as well.
>It's dimly (?) lit and there are some plants and some dark gravel.
The more cover and visual obstacles -- the better,
>PH ranges around 7 - 7.5, DH around 10. Temp is 26 Celsius.
I had found that the softwer water, lower pH and higher tempratures would
trigger spawning. However, mine were the wild fish, and the tank-bred
individuals may be less demanding (but then the trio I am trying to spawn
now is tank-raised and they are refusing to lay eggs)
>Any advise on getting them to lay eggs ?
What worked for me in the past was: high-protein live food diet (worms), a
significant drop in pH and hardness (1/3 tank water change with R/O water
laced with Tetra blackwater extract over the course of about a day) and an
increase in water temoerature to 29-31'C.
--
Oleg Kiselev at home ...use the header to find the path
>> * A. agassizii (Peruvian blue, wild)
>> * A. bitaeniata (Peruvian, wild)
>> * A. cacatuoides (red & orange)
>1. Do you mean that you have two strains each of the above
>or are you saying e.g. that the aggies are called peruvian blue,
>and that they are wild. Are the cockatoos both red and orange on the
>same fish? Living in Japan I am unsure as to terminology
>of breeds of apisto.
Sorry if that was unclear. No, the agassizii are just what we brought
back from Peru -- they're blue aggies, though some seemed to show other
colors as they grew out. Interestingly, Uwe Romer, a German apisto expert
who just spoke to the ACA in New Orleans, says that if you breed wild
aggies, regardless of whether they're blue, yellow or red, the offspring
will show all the color varieties. That is, the dominant color form in an
area is selected by environmental conditions. It is not genetically
determined.
A. cacatuoides occurs in many color varieties which do breed true. I am
aware of reds (that's one color variety, it's not red+orange) and oranges
and double reds and even triple reds, all of which I believe are
German-produced color strains. I have both red and orange varieties. The
red varieties might show some orange -- these fish have lots of different
colors on them -- but they're called reds as that is the dominant color.
I have reds and two kinds of oranges. One of the oranges is *very* large,
and the female even shows color on her caudal.
>2. I remember you as saying that some wild apisto you brought back
>from Peru was thought to be a new color form, at least to the US hobby.
>Did that turn out to be so? If so, anything published about it?
>What species, what were its characteristics?
These were blue agassizii. They looked different from the pictures in
Linke & Staeck so I thought they might be a new kind of aggie, but I now
know there are many small color variations, and these fell somewhere on
the known spectrum.
A. agassizii has the largest range of any Apisto -- it's a major-league
range for *any* fish -- so there are many regional variations. The Rio
Tefe agassizii, for instance, show two distinct color forms. One is very
red but similar to other aggie color forms. The other is spangled like a
Christmas ornament. Singular in appearance, but Romer says it breeds with
other aggie color forms and the offspring are fertile.
----------------------------------------------------
If wishes were fishes we'd all have ponds.
Pete Johnson San Jose, CA petej-at-tlg.net
----------------------------------------------------
At 09:22 PM 9/13/96 -0700, you wrote:
>How can you tell gender? When are they full grown? I've heard some
>things like F1's etc. Mine are beige/yellow with a long black streak,
>dot on face, blue/green flourescent flecks. Are there many, many types?
>OH, so many, many questions and so little, little time! ;.}
Males have a spiked tail and are quite colorful. The fameles
remain smaller and look like juveniles. They turn a very pretty
yellow they're "in the mood".
--
Usenet is a sewer. Don't waste soap trying to clean it.
- reid-at-mejac.palo-alto.ca.us
Bob wrote: >Aggies come in as many color morphs as Pseudotropheus zebra, at least. maybe >more. The first ones I owned were plain brownish in the body with brilliant >orange tails. At that time (early 80's) there were commonly seen red-tails >and purple-tails as well. But over the past several years, as the ful range >of the aggie's natural habitat has been explored, multitudinous variations >have been found. > >Bob > When Uwe Romer spoke at the San Francisco Aquarium Society meeting one to two years ago, he mentioned that all the color morphs of aggies are in the genes of all aggies (my translation of what I though I heard). In other words, if you get any pair of aggies and bred them through enough generations, you should be able to isolate all the color morphs by using various selection methods. Some years ago, I remember reading in Aquarium digest that Bitaeniata, I think they were still being called Kleei at the time, will throw both red and blue individuals in their spawns. Perhaps this is also true of Bitaeniatas. ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------------------------------------------------- This is the apistogramma mailing list, apisto-at-majordomo.pobox.com. For instructions on how to subscribe or unsubscribe or get help, email apisto-request-at-majordomo.pobox.com. Search http://altavista.digital.com for "Apistogramma Mailing List Archives"!
>I mean, suppose there is only one gene for color, and it can have >7 different values Red, Orange, Yellow, Green, Blue, Indigo and Violet. >Each aggie has 2 copies of the gene (one from each parent). Obvisouly >is your aggy has a red and violet gene, and its mate only has say, yellow >and green, none of their descendants can ever have the Blue, Indigo or Violet >values for that gene. > Frank, I have studied some population genetics and most morphological traits are thought to be the product of many different genes. Therefore, there could be some significant color variation within a population but this is a product of selection, as you suggested above. Even the Amazon is not a uniform environment, there exists many barriers to small fishes like apistos that inhabit side tributaries and creeks, such barriers restrict migration and gene flow. Therefore, I think most of the variation we see in Apistogramma is between locally unique populations that have become isolated through time, genetics and the everchanging meanders of the river, rather than within one immensely variable super population. - Steve Waldron ------------------------------------------------------------------------- This is the apistogramma mailing list, apisto-at-majordomo.pobox.com. For instructions on how to subscribe or unsubscribe or get help, email apisto-request-at-majordomo.pobox.com. Search http://altavista.digital.com for "Apistogramma Mailing List Archives"!
samaroo wrote: > > Hello, > > I was wondering if anyone has heard of, seen, or had any experience with > the following apistos. They may be made available at a local pet store, > but I have no idea what they even look like. > > 1. wild caught Alenquer aggasizzi One of the most beautiful of all A. agassizii varieties. Adults become metalic blue on body, deep yellow or orange on belly. There is a red variety, meaning more red on caudal fin, than the normal type. Not difficult to breed. Relatively prolific. > 2. Ap. sp. red point Never heard of it before. > 3. wild caught Ap. sp. smaragd emerald Very colorful population of A. geisleri. Chest emerald-green, usually with red markings. A species from the A. regani-group. In nature it is sympatric with A. agassizii 'Alenquer'. Very easy to breed, also very prolific. > > Thanks in advance, > Andy Samaroo > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > This is the apistogramma mailing list, apisto-at-majordomo.pobox.com. > For instructions on how to subscribe or unsubscribe or get help, > email apisto-request-at-majordomo.pobox.com. > Search http://altavista.digital.com for "Apistogramma Mailing List Archives"! ------------------------------------------------------------------------- This is the apistogramma mailing list, apisto-at-majordomo.pobox.com. For instructions on how to subscribe or unsubscribe or get help, email apisto-request-at-majordomo.pobox.com. Search http://altavista.digital.com for "Apistogramma Mailing List Archives"!
Steph, They may well breed with each other. Whether this is a good or a bad thing is a matter of opinion. Since these are probably domestic strains I personally see no harm. I am more in favour of keeping wild strains such as "tefe" and "rio madeiras" apart and pure. I have seen red-gold aga females with red in the tail but most do not have any colour in the tail and look the same to me. Ken. On Fri, 11 Dec 1998 20:06:23 +1100 Steph & Dave <caligula@tig.com.au> wrote: > Do all colour morphs of A. agassizi females look the same or can you > tell the difference between a 'blue' female and another colour morph. ------------------------------------------------------------------------- This is the apistogramma mailing list, apisto@majordomo.pobox.com. For instructions on how to subscribe or unsubscribe or get help, email apisto-request@majordomo.pobox.com. Search http://altavista.digital.com for "Apistogramma Mailing List Archives"!
Bill, I thought that I should comment on this question. A. gibbiceps is usually found in the middle Rio Negro between the Rio Branco & Rio Uaupés. A. agassizii has been found in the lower reaches of the Rio Negro, but is replaced in the Anavilhanus Archipelago by a different agassizii-complex species, A. gephyra. Mayland's photo of "A. agassizii Santarém" in the Aqualog book is not A. agassizii. It is A. gephyra (or something close to it). It probably is the same fish Römer reports as A. gephyra from Lago Jurucuí near Santarém. My guess, without seeing your fish, is that you have a group of A. gephyra from the Rio Negro. I go along with Gary about names on fish. If it hasn't descended from stock that originated in an absolutely, positively, expressly recorded collecting location _ do not _ give it a population name. Because it is an export station, there are probably a half dozen aggie populations with "Santarém" in their names. Just list species with unknown location as whatever species it is and leave it at that. This is especially true with A. agassizii where I feel that we are dealing with a superspecies - a grouping of several closely related sibling species (semispecies) that can interbreed in the aquarium but don't have the opportunity to do so in the wild. There are those who consider A. gephyra to be the ultimate expression of a semispecies within the A. agassizii superspecies, but this is taxonomist fodder, nothing worth worrying about. Mike Wise Bill Phillips wrote: > Hello from Australia and hoping that someone can shed some light on a wild > apisto pair that I was fortunate enough to obtain as a contaminant. > > A shipment of apisto gibbiceps came into the wholesaler and my LFS found > some Apisto agassizii (about 3 pairs) in the shipment. The problem then > arose as to what strain the fish is - comparing with the AQualog catalogue > suggests the strain is "santarem". > > My question (crossing my fingers) is whether gibbiceps is localised in a > particular area which may shed some light on the possible agissizii strain. > Probably just my luck that gibbiceps is widespread in its distribution. > > Many thanks for any help > > Bill Phillips > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > This is the apistogramma mailing list, apisto@listbox.com. > For instructions on how to subscribe or unsubscribe or get help, > email apisto-request@listbox.com. > Search http://altavista.digital.com for "Apistogramma Mailing List Archives"!
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This page was last updated 02 July 2000 | ||